Conservatives condone suspension of due process and torture of children.
And then there’s this one, which makes me so angry I’m not sure I can even write coherently about it.
A day after a report revealed Canadian officials knew of Omar Khadr’s harsh treatment by the U.S. military, Prime Minister Stephen Harper on Thursday repeated vows to leave the case in U.S. hands.
…
A Canadian official visiting Khadr in 2004 in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, was told the U.S. military was depriving the then 17-year-old of sleep for weeks to make him “more amenable and willing to talk,” according to a newly released internal report from the Foreign Affairs Department.
“Canada has sought assurances that Mr. Khadr, under our government, will be treated humanely. We are monitoring those legal processes very carefully.”
Canada “frankly has no real alternative” to the U.S. legal process, he went on to say.
So, the US took a kid, a Canadian kid, to their special extralegal prison, have tortured1 him for six years, have been told by their own courts that they can’t hold him like this (something they’ve ignored for more than a year), and WE KNEW ABOUT IT THE WHOLE TIME. And we’re OK with it. And we trust the US now when they tell us that they’re treating him better now? And even if we didn’t there’s nothing we can do?
I don’t think so Mr. Harper. We should be mortified as a nation that our government knew this was happening and didn’t do everything in it’s power to stop it. We certainly can’t say “oh well, water under the bridge, and I’m sure it’s much better now”. Every other Western national has been out of Gitmo for a while now–the only one left is the child.
And I don’t understand how he can even say that with a straight face when the Supreme Court of Canada ruled, years ago, that the conditions at Gitmo were unacceptable by Canadian Constitutional standards–a ruling the outlawed any further Canadian participation in activities and interrogations there. Or considering a federal court judge ruled last week that the treatment was a violation of international human rights.
And now we’re hearing details of the “interrogation methods” and seeing videos of the interrogations, and finally Canadians are apparently starting to care about this. It is nice to hear the Liberals saying “knowing what we know now, we should bring him back to Canada” with the implicit “our decision not to fight for him when were were in power was wrong”. It’s even nicer to hear the NDP call it “disgraceful”, and to have them (finally!) call for some oversight of CSIS.
You might expect a minority government to care about the will of the people on an issue like this, but not Mr. Harper.
You know what I’d like? A government that didn’t condone the torture of prisoners (especially, but not only, children), that didn’t condone extra-legal prisons, that encouraged supposedly friendly nations to actually, you know, try someone they think is guilty of a crime and either convict them or let them go. A government that respected the ideas of due process and civil liberties. Especially, you know, in the case of a minor.
Actually the only entity that has done things to be proud of in this affair are the courts–the Canadian courts have made decision after decision that seem sensible and correct, despite government pressure. The ruling mentioned above, and the ones that required CSIS to turn their information over to Kadr’s defense team, among others, stand out as examples.
I was discussing this with some Americans today at work and I ran into the “well, he killed an American soldier, he deserves it” thing. I couldn’t argue it without entering into unprofessional behaviour, but you know, if you can prove that he did kill a soldier, then try him and sentence him. You don’t torture him for six years. And even if he did it, and you find him guilty–you can’t condone the torture of prisoners. Period.
A teenage kid who kills a cop doesn’t get six years of torture before his day in court. And of course, he might not have actually done it. How many successful convictions so far of the people held at Gitmo? And…
Prosecutors say Khadr, then 15, threw the grenade, but other documents have suggested it was an adult militant who killed Speer, or that he was shot by a member of his own platoon.
and
In February 2008, the Pentagon accidentally released documents that revealed that although Khadr was present during the firefight, there was no other evidence that he had thrown the grenade. In fact, military officials had originally reported that another of the surviving militants had thrown the grenade just before being killed. (source)
Sure might be nice to prove the crime before the punishment starts. Not, you know, after six years of torture.
And, let’s be honest, at this point (hell, long before this point) the idea that there is any kind of acceptable legal process at work in Guantanamo is a joke. And Mr. Harper either knows that, or he’s even dumber than I think he is.
Additional references:
- The Wikipedia Entry
- Ottawa fought Khadr’s transfer to Gitmo
- ‘Don’t believe what you’ve heard,’ Omar Khadr pleads in prison letter
- Omar Khadr Gitmo Trial Set for Oct 8
- Omar Khadr Video of Gitmo Questioning Released
- In the minds of everyone but Dick Cheney this is torture.(back)
Tags: bush,canada,civil liberties,fuck you stephen harper,iraq,torture,USA,war
Kira
b3n
Sharon
July 16th, 2008 at 1:13 am
first, why him this kid not hero for fight foreign invader when just the boy of 15 years old? am him family proud the courage? why khadr not hero? because boy take out ameriki and ameriki so ashame? then to torture?
ameriki him so the big hero and tough guy when to torture the child. am proud mr. tuf ameriki? how many usa soldier the sick brain and danger?
usa to suffering so much for cruel and the torture. now for ameriki economic to punish and suffering and to fight aztec and maya for land. him whitie man now finish and this the punish for it wicked ameriki to tortured it children.
also for punish now ameriki him daughtyer just full slut take LBT (low back tattoo) to sex with every man even it gang member. but ameriki him no even the ashame. and him son the gay homosexual and him wife lesbian never to love cook food for family.
not all it ameriki so the wicked but even him to suffer equal with bad ameriki.
July 16th, 2008 at 1:29 am
If this isn’t at the top of the list, I’m terrified. What I hate about the 21st century is everything can get worse.
July 16th, 2008 at 9:37 am
Just to let you now, the NDP has been demanding better and more oversight for CSIS for years. Also, the NDP was in the House demanding that the then Liberal government repatriate Khadr to ensure that he have a fair and timely trial in accordance with UN conventions on child soldiers.
July 17th, 2008 at 1:07 am
Not news to me Jay–I’ve been an NDP voter for a long time now. Hell, I’ve stuck in there despite Layton giving me the used car salesman vibe rather than the true believer one.
July 19th, 2008 at 7:28 pm
Hypocrisy of the “Repatriate Omar Khadr to Canada” Movement
As soon as the Gitmo interrogation tape of Omar Khadr hit the Internet, the blogosphere was flooded with demands to repatriate him to Canada. This wave is reminiscent of a Soviet campaign to free Luis Corvalán from the “fascist regime” of Augusto Pinochet thirty five years ago. The scenario is strikingly similar. A “victim” held by “fascist regimes” this time run by Bush and Harper, and a public outcry for justice. Except for the fact that Luis Corvalán didn’t kill anyone and didn’t fight for a terrorist group that wants to impose Sharia.
The “repatriate Khadr” crowd describes him as “a child”, “a kid”, “a boy”, and even “a torture victim”, with no facts to substantiate the torture claims notwithstanding. They complain about Khadr being mistreated, again, without anything to back up their claims. Some of them are outraged about “child abuse.” And they all scream for justice.
They want justice? OK, let’s talk about JUSTICE. What about justice for Sgt. First Class Christopher J. Speer, who was (according to an eyewitness) murdered by this “child”? What about justice for Tabitha Speer, who is a widow because of this “kid”? What about justice for Taryn and Tanner Speer, who are left without a father by this “a boy”? And what about all those Afghani civilians and NATO troops who are a little bit safer because this “torture victim” is behind bars? How many of these “repatriate Khadr” hypocrites concern themselves with justice for real victims? In literally hundreds of posts, we couldn’t find a single one.
One would ask, what is the reason for this idiocy? The answer is simple. Ignorance. Complete and utter ignorance. Let’s forget for a second that Omar Khadr killed Christopher Speer. Let’s forget that Khadr’s father was an al Qaeda financier. Let’s forget that Khadr’s family is known for it being al Qaeda sympathizers. Let’s just remember what this “child” was fighting for in Afghanistan.
This is what Taliban-imposed Sharia looks like in real life: http://muslimsagainstsharia.blogspot.com/2000/07/hypocrisy-of-repatriate-omar-khadr-to.html
Why don’t all of you, bleeding heart demagogues go to Afghanistan and spend a day in a Taliban-controlled territory? And let’s talk about Khadr when you get back. If you get back.
July 23rd, 2008 at 3:38 pm
I just love when a post draws a reply from someone who obviously didn’t even take the time to read the post.
Normally I don’t hold with feeding the trolls, but just this once:
Your first paragraph implies that I am reacting to the Khadr video, and that my objections to Gitmo, the denial of due process, and the disappearing of people, all stem from that. If you browse through this blog a bit you’ll see that is not the case. I have been objecting to these things through their entire life.
Also you want to make a distinction between people held by facist regimes who killed someone and those who didn’t. Right there we’re on different pages. Without even getting into the question of the legality of the US unilateral illegal wars, you can break this point down. If you assume Khadr did in fact kill someone (something unproven, and had you read my post you would see links to substantiate that), then either he’s a prisoner of war, or a criminal, depending on whether or not you recognize his status. In either case he is entitled to protection of torture and some kind of due process. And that’s before you think about him being a teenager at the time–all civilized legal systems recognize that the question of responsibility is not cut and dried for legal minors, but that seems to be something you want us to ignore here.
Which leads into your second paragraph: Yes Khadr is described as a child, and a boy. Know why? He was 15 when he was imprisoned. He was a kid. That’s a fact.
If you don’t admit at this point that a lot of what happens at Gitmo is torture, I’m not going to convince you. Just the extended sleep deprivation thing should count, in my books, but there’s a lot of other stuff going on there–again, do a little research and you can find articles about it. Had you read my post you would see specific links to Canadian court rulings about Gitmo and how the treatment of prisoners there was a violation of fundamental human rights–and that’s just based on what’s been made public. Are we meant to trust that the same people who ran Abu Ghraib aren’t keeping some special surprises hidden behind the blanket of homeland security?
In your third paragraph you raise the spectre of the victims, as if that somehow justified denial of due process, torture, and mistreatment of a minor. Think about this question: if a drug dealing 15 year old shot a cop who was legally trying to arrest him, what would happen? Would the kid get disappeared for six years before his trial? Would the treatment Khadr’s had been acceptable? Obviously not, but there would still be a dead peace office, a widow, and children without a parent. Why is Khadr’s case so different? And all of that, of course, turns on whether or not he actually did it–something which, as I said above, is in dispute. Something which one would a government to be able to conclusively prove before incarcerating someone, much less after holding them for six years. Your hypothetical cop-killing minor would be out by now, but Khadr’s still without trial.
Then you get really crazy and say that trying to defend the rule of law, due process, and controls on government activity will somehow result in us all living in Taliban conditions. And that’s where we really part company: because I see civil rights, a constrained legal system, and the importance of due process as three of the most important things that differentiate us from people living under those conditions.
But let’s be honest, you’ll never read this, you were a keyword-driven driveby who didn’t even read the post, and who’s opinion is made up based on the facts you liked, without reference to the ones that you chose to ignore.
July 23rd, 2008 at 6:57 pm
Normally I don’t hold with feeding the idiotss, but just this once:
“Your first paragraph implies that I am reacting to the Khadr video”
Actually the first paragraph states a specific fact and does not imply anything. There is no reason to read between the lines when there is nothing there.
Your reaction could might as well be a direct result of your ignorance which is proven by your “the denial of due process, and the disappearing of people” comment. It may have nothing to do with the video.
“people held by facist regimes”
Only a degenerate dumbfuck would describe a terrorist held by his government that way.
“Right there we’re on different pages.”
That’s quite an understatement.
“the legality of the US unilateral illegal wars”
Aren’t you one dumb masochistic fuck?
You seem to passionately hate the government, but you’re still here. Do you enjoy emotional distress that much? Mistress Xena does not provide you with enough pain? Why don’t you do yourself (and this country) a favor and get the fuck out of here? Every human being, even a dumbfuck like you deserves to be happy. Wouldn’t you be happier in a country where you can respect and support your government?
July 23rd, 2008 at 7:32 pm
Ahhhh - theres nothing like a troll to confirm my belief that the world is full of morons.